Multiple people in discussion

[cream]

Adult rec league. Home plate umpire calls 2 balks on a pitcher in an inning. The team that was balked is confused as to why they were called balks. After the inning has been completed, the pitcher and a non-designated player-manager approach the umpire to politely discuss the rule interpretation. As they are talking, the shortstop stands in the conversation out of interest. How do you deal?

[CoachJM]

cream,

As long as everybody's "polite", I'll give them a clear, concise explanation of the balk(s).

Anybody starts "arguing", everyone but the manager/captain gets shooed away.

JM

[semper_fi_72]

Agree with CoachJM
As long as everyone remains polite I will give them the explanation and education.
We need to remain approachable.

[Brotherhood_of_Blue]

As semper_fi states it's important to remain approachable, especially when we're dealing with adult leagues where feathers are a little more easily ruffled. Often times just providing them a little light on the situation goes miles in future discussions.

That said, make sure you keep yourself open to any type of discussion from the other side so that they feel like their getting their "fair share". Again, this is all assuming polite, and reasonable behavior. First sign of an argument time to close the curtain.

[ump_24]

Just to add here

When dealing with this situation, probably a good idea to have a partner come in and also listen in, in the event crowd control is needed.

[cream]

As semper_fi states it's important to remain approachable, especially when we're dealing with adult leagues where feathers are a little more easily ruffled. Often times just providing them a little light on the situation goes miles in future discussions.

That said, make sure you keep yourself open to any type of discussion from the other side so that they feel like their getting their "fair share". Again, this is all assuming polite, and reasonable behavior. First sign of an argument time to close the curtain.

What would you say if one of them started arguing?

[heyblue26]

What would you say if one of them started arguing?

Agree with Semper_Fi and CoachJM and what others have mentioed here about being approachable and let them ask for the explaination and give it too them. But if anyone wants to start arguing just mention to them you asked me for a explaination I will give you it but I will only explain it to the HC all others end of disscussion back to their positions. Hope that you're partner is with in a ear shot to hear what is being explained.

[Brotherhood_of_Blue]

What would you say if one of them started arguing?

Coach, you had a question, I gave you the answer, it's now time to play ball. Look to partner to help disperse the crowd and move to whatever position your supposed to be at. If someone wants to try and continue an argument they now have to come after me, which will be met with "That's enough" or "move on".

[Tim_C]

Hmm, let's look at this from a slighty different light:

When I call a balk I tell them what it was in five words or less.

That is the last conversation I have about that balk.

There would be no need for a conversation at the plate in my game.

Actually there would be no conversation at the plate concerning a balk at a game where I was umpiring.

People don't argue balls/strikes or balks (even in a "nice" tone.)

T

[semperfiguy]

Well put Tim. Although I agree we cant always put up a wall to coaches and players, like Tim said we dont discuss balls/ strikes, why would you bother discussing a balk. Balls and strikes baby!!!!

[catsbackr]

There is no problem with being approachable. However, I do not want to get in "converstations" with coaches regarding rules or especially judgement calls. They can read the rules just like I have and if they have read the rules, they know its a rules violation to argue judgement calls, anyway.

There is also nothing wrong with putting up walls either. On a balk call, like Tim said, 5-10 words is all that is needed. "No discernable stop, coach" or "He didn't step to the base, coach", etc. Any more discussion and you start coaching, not umpiring.

[cream]

There is no problem with being approachable. However, I do not want to get in "converstations" with coaches regarding rules or especially judgement calls. They can read the rules just like I have and if they have read the rules, they know its a rules violation to argue judgement calls, anyway.

There is also nothing wrong with putting up walls either. On a balk call, like Tim said, 5-10 words is all that is needed. "No discernable stop, coach" or "He didn't step to the base, coach", etc. Any more discussion and you start coaching, not umpiring.

I like to take things a step further hypothetically. Say I'm the manager and after you said "no discernable stop, coach", I said "how do you judge a discernable stop?" what would your response be?

[SocalBlue1]

I like to take things a step further hypothetically. Say I'm the manager and after you said "no discernible stop, coach", I said "how do you judge a discernible stop?" what would your response be?

Keep the comments short & simple - "He didn't stop". Response like "no discernible stop, coach" leave the door open to further argument, exactly what we DON'T want?

[Brotherhood_of_Blue]

I like to take things a step further hypothetically. Say I'm the manager and after you said "no discernable stop, coach", I said "how do you judge a discernable stop?" what would your response be?

Cream;
Again, this is where what Tim stated above comes into play, especially when your dealing with younger age divisions.

Keep EVERYTHING short. The explanation, the meeting/conference, etc., etc. especially when it's about something that just happened or was called.

"Didn't Stop", "Under the Tag", "beat the throw". In the OP we have a player/manager and somebody else trying to get information. How much info and time you give them is the tricky part. Keep it short and sweet, but remain professional and approachable, especially when dealing with Adult Leagues. Move them along and disperse the crowd. Your calling a game, not hosting a clinic.

[Tim_C]

"I said "how do you judge a discernable stop?" what would your response be?"

Simple:

I would stare at you and say: "That's enough Skip!"

T

[lustersilk]

"Five words or less"

[jjb]

Remember the following phrase: "My Judgement". It requires no explanation, no discussion, and any further argument will be counter-productive to what you're trying to do out there.

The more you try and explain the more you'll extend the argument. Keep it very short. It is what it is, simply because you say that it is....

[dash_riprock]

Well put Tim. Although I agree we cant always put up a wall to coaches and players, like Tim said we dont discuss balls/ strikes, why would you bother discussing a balk. Balls and strikes baby!!!!

Semper Fi - Isn't it "Strikes and outs baby?"